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When we first meet, it’s hard to believe that the last time I saw Matthew Lillard, he was being brutally impaled by several failed spring-locks while stuck in the husk of an animatronic rabbit suit. “I always come back,” he’d snarled out on the big screen as the formidable foe William Afton from last year’s cult horror hit Five Nights at Freddy’s.

“I was on Drew Barrymore this morning. I was very nervous, really,” Lillard offhandedly mentions at the beginning of our chat with a smile, almost sheepishly. “She’s such a sweetheart, so I don’t know why. I was super nervous.” Not quite the Pumpkin King on a throne of blood and guts, so to speak. There’s a lot that Lillard waxes philosophical about regarding his career, but perhaps most surprising to the 54-year-old Scream actor is the way he’s been almost continuously cast as various villains and ne’er-do-wells throughout the years.

“I just did a show for Amazon Prime where I play a horrible person, and I’m like, ‘why?’ [Laughs],” Lillard told Rolling Stone. “My mother-in-law is so distraught. What is it that I don’t see that everyone else sees where I’m this bad guy all the time? I am shocked that I played Shaggy. From that moment on, I’m just the worst white guy in the world [Laughs].” But to the thousands of fans of his roles in films like Scooby-Doo and now Five Nights at Freddy’s (which range from the child-appropriately thrilling, to the downright gory), there’s just something that clicks about seeing Lillard’s usual, affable charm plunge deep into terrifying territory.

Lillard has been leaning into his own horror roots now, too, from hosting the competition baking show Killer Cakes on Prime Video, to successfully launching the liquor company Find Familiar Spirits in 2023. However he feels about being regarded as a modern “horror icon”, Lillard now wants to give back to the fans, releasing a horror-themed premium tequila line, Macabre Spirits. Described as “the world’s first tequila made by and for fans of horror”, they’ve really thought of everything for true lovers of the genre here — from the bottle’s art inspired by “Danse Macabre” skeletons from the Middle Ages, to the original novella that comes with the small-batch reposado.

Titled Rare, Fine & Limited, the 70-page short story was written by legendary horror director Mike Flanagan (The Haunting of Hill House, Fall of the House of Usher, Midnight Mass) just for this release. Preorders for Macabre opened on October 22, and the bottle expects to ship in Jan. 2025. Just in time for Halloween, Lillard sat down with Rolling Stone to talk fandom in horror, the evolution of his career, and why we love to be scared.

How did the overall concept emerge behind Find Familiar Spirits?

Well, first and foremost, the question we ask with Find Familiar Spirits is, ‘what value do we bring to the fans’? I will never allow us to transact on people’s passions without providing something for them. So to see somebody fall in love with, say, Avatar: The Last Airbender and just sell them whiskey with an air bender on it, that isn’t enough. We don’t want to be Bulleit Rye, either — we’re building a company around the idea of developing high end spirits like luxury nerd goods. Seeing people where they’re at, finding the piece of joy that they have in their lives, and building something that celebrates that.

It’s the most random experience, but Dungeon & Dragons, right? If you’re not gonna do something around D&D, then don’t do something for D&D. When we launched with Quest’s End Whiskey, we built each bottle as a different character in the story. The character transitions through all 16 of the drops. Every expression of the liquid is different, as a Paladin is different from a Rogue, which is different than a Warlock. You can’t just arbitrarily switch them out — that’s how emphatic we were in terms of building a flavor profile for a specific class.

What was it specifically about Mike Flanagan’s work that drew you to partnering with him for the Macabre Spirits release?

Lillard: We love the idea of literary horror, and I had just done a movie with Mike Flanagan called Life of Chuck. I just fell in love with him. I mean, he is an incredible director, writer, and a fantastic human being. So in one of our pitch meetings internally, I threw out there, what if we went to Flanagan to write the first novella? And he’s sober, which I thought may not make sense, but I reached out to him anyway. To his credit, he jumped at it. The idea of writing a short story was really exciting to him, because he had never done it before. I think from everything he says now that it was a hugely rewarding experience for him. Knowing his voice and who he is as a person, and then offering him the opportunity something he hadn’t done before — that was really exciting for both of us.

I know his short story taps into this Edgar Allan Poe-esque style of gothic horror. How do you think literary horror, or the way that literature scares us, differs from the way that we get scared from what’s on the big screen?

Lillard: That’s a great question. Look, literature is the action of the mind, which is eternally more horrifying. The images that we conjure in our imagination are evocative in such a different way than when somebody’s feeding you visual images, right? Terrifier 3 just came out — it’s huge, successful. But there’s nothing left to the imagination. You’re sort of witnessing every ounce of gore there is to present. I just think that literary horror offers a different kind of titillation in the imagination that we get excited about. [With Macabre Spirits], we’re building something for the fans. Rare, Fine & Limited is a love letter to the community. What do we have to provide? It’s this new look at these traditional ghost stories.

In a strange way, we sometimes love to be scared. Why do you think that is?

Lillard: I think that so much of life is us seeking connection to things. We’re on social media, and we’re hoping that some kind of connection comes back from this fucking phone. It never does [Laughs]. It’s a one way transaction. But the idea of sitting at a gaming table, the idea of sitting in a dark theater? There’s a visceral reaction, something happens to you as you’re sitting and witnessing these films, or you’re playing around a table. Those dopamine hits are real and authentic. And I think that’s what differentiates [the horror genre] from, say, an action comedy, rom-com, or historical drama. We like to be scared because it gets our pulses racing. We feel differently. That’s what’s so alluring about horror.

For yourself, you’ve been considered this modern horror icon, which I know wasn’t always something that you’ve embraced—

Lillard: I’ve never embraced it [Laughs]. That’s something everybody else says.

So not like a Tobin Bell (John Kramer of the Saw franchise)-type thing?

Lillard: Yeah, me and Tobin. Same level [Laughs].

Then, reflecting back on your more recent success with films like Five Nights at Freddy’s, how do you see yourself in that kind of role now?

Lillard: I mean, I’m having a whole Matthew Lillard 2.0 era happening. That, is palpable. I talked about it recently, but I’m super grateful for it. You know, when you’re young and coming up and Scream happens, you’re always looking for what’s next, what’s more, right? Especially as a young actor, you’re like, Scream happened, but yeah, it’s whatever — I want more. And it’s when you’re at the top of your journey, when you’re coming around towards the end of your career — not that I’m there right now, but I’m not a new kid on the block, right? You certainly appreciate it so much on such a deeper level. It’s so funny, you know. The minute you’re like, oh, I’m the shit, you immediately wipe out. That’s when you when you fall the furthest.

But now I love being able to celebrate those things [like Scream]. Not that I’m interested in, like, holding on to them so tightly. But in my entire life, I’ve always thought, who cares about what I’ve done before? Let’s just get to the next. Now, as I’m older, I’m not so interested in the next. I’m really interested in the now. And so the now of this moment, the now of my career, is really lovely. It’s lovely to walk on set and have people excited that I’m there.

You’ve described Scream before as an “acting training ground” for you. But were there any other sort of hidden horror films or gems from your catalog that you feel like were an important experience to your growth as an actor?

Lillard: SLC Punk. The confidence that movie gave me to carry a film, it’s super powerful to me. There’s a moment at the end of the film where Stevo loses his best friend, and that’s a moment I’m super proud of as an actor. To me, that film represents what I always aspire to be, which is number one on the call sheet [Laughs]. I want to be the star of every film I’ve ever been in. Hasn’t gone my way that often, but that did, and it allows me to know that I have what it takes to be in a film and have it work. Then having a movie like FNaF is like having another opportunity in my life to have a franchise, having an appreciation for that fan base. You know, I’ve been really lucky in my life to have a couple of great franchises, but I realize they don’t come along very often.

It’s so funny too, because William Afton is another villain role for you.

Lillard: I’m the most despised person! I just did a show for Amazon Prime where I play a horrible person, and I’m like, ‘why?’ [Laughs]. My mother-in-law is so distraught. What is it that I don’t see that everyone else sees where I’m this bad guy all the time? I am shocked that I played Shaggy. From that moment on, I’m just the worst white guy in the world.

I do think, candidly, I have fun acting. I have a joy about the work I do that I think permeates everything I do. So when I’m bad, I love being a bad guy. You love to hate the bad guy, yeah? And listen, quite frankly, I don’t have the pecs or the abs to be number one on the call anymore. So now I’m like, number four on the call, but I do have a mustache I can twist. So it is fun.

What challenges do you find, if any, switching from narrative acting to being a show host, like on Killer Cakes?

Lillard: When I was a kid, I never would have done something like this. I would have been like, oh, this is so fucking below me. I wouldn’t do it. But look, I like it. It’s funny, it’s not like I’ve ever made enough money to retire and walk into the sunset, right?

Very few do.

Lillard: And that’s the thing! I don’t think enough people talk about how hard it is to sustain a lifetime in the arts. It’s virtually impossible unless you have something else that can sort of help keep you afloat. And I do. I have conventions, which has been a huge game changer for me, and changed my life to be honest. But when Killer Cakes came along, there’s also the idea of, are you going to grow old gracefully in a business and be able to make ends meet? Am I even going to be a good host? Mayhaps, that opens up other opportunities. So I was excited to take it on, but it also scared me. I was nervous about being able to do it. I haven’t seen it yet, but people seem to like it, which is good. That’s all I care about.

Speaking of conventions, has there been a particular experience at a con, or a fan interaction, that has stuck with you over the years?

Lillard: I do, so clearly. Early on in my convention life, I had a girl in New Jersey at a VIP party say to me: “I was gonna kill myself last year, but I saw that you were on the schedule. I was preparing to end my own life, and I decided to stick around to see you, and I did. And from that day, I got a job, and I got my life together and everything swam back the other way.” And she was like, “here’s my mom and dad to say thank you”. So for me, it was that moment.

And I’ve had multiple interactions with queer kids, kids struggling with addiction, adults even, etc, that I realized that the beauty of this job isn’t free tickets to the Mets. The beauty of the job is the idea of being able to impact people’s lives, right? The value of fame has nothing to do with you — it’s the effects on other people, not what it gives you. If you have the ability to see that and use it for good, then it’s a beautiful thing.